KCAI CL-3x0 paintkit query

  • Ich versuche, einige Repaints für den Ken Carson CL-350 (Jet Story) zu machen, aber das mit dem Modell gelieferte Paint-Kit öffnet sich nicht richtig in meinem Grafikprogramm. Das Kit wurde als PSD gespeichert und ich verwende PSP X8, und keine der Ebenenfunktionen ist verfügbar, obwohl die Ebenen sichtbar und korrekt eingerichtet sind. Ich habe es als PSPIMAGE gespeichert und wieder geöffnet, und die Ebenen sind immer noch ein Problem, da ich keine neuen erstellen kann. Der Speichervorgang sagt mir, dass die Ebenen alle in Rasterebenen umgewandelt werden, was nutzlos ist, da der Hintergrund und die Details alle kombiniert werden und nicht richtig gemalt werden können.

    Gibt es ein kompatibleres Paintkit, oder muss ich jede Ebene/Gruppe löschen, die Ergebnisse speichern und dann alle Ebenen so neu erstellen, dass die PSP sie verstehen kann - oder wird das auch nicht funktionieren?!

    Ich mache das gerne, wenn es funktioniert, aber das P/K hat ein paar hundert Schichten!

    +++

    I'm trying to make some repaints for the Ken Carson CL-350 (Jet Story) but the paint kit that comes with the model is not opening properly in my graphics program. The kit was saved as PSD and I'm using PSP X8, and none of the layers functionality is available even though the layers are visible and correctly set up. I've saved it as PSPIMAGE and reopened it, and the layers are still a problem, since I can't make new ones. The save operation tells me that the layers will all be converted into raster layers, which is useless since the background and the details are all combined and can't be painted properly.

    Is there a more compatible paintkit around, or will I need to delete every layer/group, save the results, and then remake all the layers in a way that PSP can understand - or will that also not end up working?!

    I'm happy to do that if it'll work, but the p/k has a few hundred layers!

    “Every word has consequences. Every silence, too.” - Sartre

  • Richard, I opened the paintkit using Photoshop Elements. Some unsupported layers were lost but I think everything you need is there. To download my saved version of the paintkit follow this link .

    This is a fairly hefty file so let me know when you have it so I can delete it from my dropbox. Let me know if you are able to use it.

    Greg

    Note: This link now disabled because files removed.

    Greg_Putz

    Regina Canada

    Einmal editiert, zuletzt von g a p u t z (24. September 2021 07:35)

  • Many thanks, Greg, I have the file.

    I'll open it in PSP X8 and see what I have. Hopefully it'll allow me to get something done!

    There seem to be layers for everything, even the chrome bezels around pitots, etc are separated out. The main problem is that PSP X8 has all the layers menu items grayed out, so there's evidently something in there that has stopped PSP from seeing them as layers despite the hierarchy of layers being visible in the program. Hopefully whatever your Photoshop Elements did when dropping unsupported layers will be enough to allow me in, since I'm not even given the option to create a new layer or "paste as new layer" etc.

    I only wish that Corel's extensive online help also went into why the program might not be able to do things!

    The weird thing is that I can load the PSD into PSP and save in a native format, but reopening that PSP "conversion" still has all the layers uneditable and no ability to add layers (which is probably all I want to do anyway). Hopefully Photoshop might have done something different to open it up more.

    Thanks for the "conversion", I'll get back later today (UK-time) and let you know how it went.

    “Every word has consequences. Every silence, too.” - Sartre

  • Hi Greg -

    Sadly the p/k still has the layers all blocked. I'll have to find what's causing this.

    I downloaded The Gimp and opened the PSD in that program, on another computer, and the layers are fine, but when I save that and try to open it in PSP the same problem is there. I may just have to learn a whole other graphics program - and that computer has a trackerball rather than a mouse, so I'll have to change the hardware as well.

    Unfortunately there's no other intermediate format I could pass the file through that might fix the layers. I think I'll just move all the layers out of groups, see if that works, and then re-integrate the layers into groups in PSP.

    No other p/k I've used has ever given this problem. I think the only way is for me to reorganize the layers longhand.

    “Every word has consequences. Every silence, too.” - Sartre

  • Richard, I am able to open the files in my very old Corel Paintshop Pro X program. I converted the files to .PSP. See if you get any joy out of these. Follow the link to here and download. You are right, so many layers!

    Don't ask me any questions about using PSP X. I bought it for the singular purpose of doing night textures for my scenery projects. It has a way better lighting effects feature than my equally antiquated Photoshop programs. But hey, they do the trick for me so never needed to upgrade.

    Greg

    Greg_Putz

    Regina Canada

  • Hi Greg -

    Weirdly enough, we've been talking about the problem all along!

    I tried your PSP files and still there was this problem, even though the layers were largely ungrouped and separated out with presumably all the PSD features removed by the import. This was the only paint kit that causes this problem, I opened other paint kits, some quite large files with complex structure, and none had the same problem.

    I tried a couple other approaches this morning with no luck. I ended up using your PSP file and started indicscriminately hacking away layers and checking the layer drop-down to see whether layers suddenly became available. Against all my expectatations they eventually did. I hacked away about 8 layers and the options came back. I then undid the last delete of a bunch of layers and instead deleted them singly to get to the first one that gave me the options back, saved the file, and reopened it in The Gimp, which has a layer count in the title bar. 499 layers sounds suspiciously like a man-made limit, and I'm reasonably certain now that it's a hard limit on layers imposed by PSP X8.

    Since the paint kit had (IMHO) a vast amount of redundant micro-layers in it (pitot chrome rings that could surely be flattened along with a bunch of similar features) I will go through and merge many of the subgroups into single layers in order to get the paint kit to work with X8 and perhaps other programs that might be limited on layers. Either that or learn The Gimp!

    “Every word has consequences. Every silence, too.” - Sartre

  • I didn't do an extensive review of the layers but it is obvious the level of detail in this paint kit is incredible. Dedicated layers to very minute details, such as the chrome rings you mention. I suspect you've hit on reason for all your grief. After you flatten all those details into a single layer give us a progress report. And maybe a copy of the textures when all is said and done :)

    Greg

    Greg_Putz

    Regina Canada

  • Ich habe ein stark vereinfachtes Paintkit gemacht. Offensichtlich gibt es Kompromisse für PSP X8, und die meisten Leute würden dies nicht brauchen. Im Original gibt es viele Variationen der Layer-Sichtbarkeit und offensichtlich sind alle diese Werte jetzt eingefroren, wenn sie sich auf einem der konsolidierten Layer befinden - nicht, dass ich sie jemals ändern würde! Ich habe viele Ebenen getrennt gelassen, wenn ich kreativ werden möchte. Alle sichtbar signifikanten Bits können ein- und ausgeschaltet werden (z. B. Chrome Leading Edge am Tail (2 Abschnitte). Mehr Details wären für 2048x-Texturen nützlich, aber wir haben es mit FS9 zu tun, also werden alle 4 Pixel beim Erstellen der BMPs zu 1 verkleinert, und viele Dinge, die bei 2048x wichtig sind, sind bei 1024x nicht annähernd so offensichtlich.

    Abgesehen davon, dass es zu viele Ebenen für meinen Grafikeditor gab, wäre es eine ziemliche Suche gewesen, um herauszufinden, auf welcher Ebene sich etwas befindet!

    Ich habe drei Repaints für Jet Story herausgebracht, 2x CL350s (SP-ZEN und SP-KHI) und deren CL300 (SP-ZSZ). Ziemlich rudimentär, da ich nicht von Details besessen bin (besonders bei 300 pro Schicht ...) und nur grundlegende Fähigkeiten habe. Es gibt bereits eine Version von SP-WAA. Ich muss sie noch in der Sim überprüfen.

    Sie sind Teil meiner ständigen gelegentlichen Bemühungen, die Anzahl der 52-Wochen-Flugpläne in FS9 zu erhöhen und jede Woche ein Gefühl von zufälligen Überraschungen einzuführen. Muenier hat die ERJs gemacht, ein paar Leute haben sich an SP-TOP versucht. Die Lears sind fertig, ebenso die BAe 125 (OCH). Es gibt den Premier 1 (SP-RIO) sowie die Globals, SP-ZAK und SP-WOI. Dann kann ich mit der Installation einiger 52-Wochen-Pläne für die VIP-, SAR- (CN-295W-), DHC8A-, Challenger- und C-17-Flotten der kanadischen Luftwaffe fortfahren.

    +++

    I made a vastly simplified paintkit. Obviously there are compromises for PSP X8, and most people wouldn't need to use this. In the original there are lots of variations on layer visibility and obviously all of those values are now frozen if they were on one of the consolidated layers - not that I was ever going to change them! I've left a lot of the layers separated out if I might want to get creative. All visibly significant bits can be switched on and off (chrome leading edge on the tail (2 sections), for example). More detail would be useful for 2048x textures, but we're dealing with FS9, so every 4 pixels are going to be scrunched down into 1 when the BMPs are created, and many things important at 2048x aren't nearly so obvious at 1024x.

    Apart from there being too many layers for my graphics editor, it would have been quite a search to find what layer something was on!

    I turned out three repaints for Jet Story, 2x CL350s (SP-ZEN and SP-KHI) and their CL300 (SP-ZSZ). Fairly rudimentary since I'm not someone that obsesses over details (especially at 300 per layer...) and with only basic ability. There's already a version of SP-WAA out there. I've yet to check them in the sim.

    They're part of my ongoing occasional effort to beef up the number of 52-week flightplans in FS9 and introduce a sense of random surprises each week. Muenier did the ERJs, a couple of folk have had a try at SP-TOP. The Lears are done, as is the BAe 125 (OCH). There's the Premier 1 (SP-RIO) to do as well as the Globals, SP-ZAK and SP-WOI. I can then get on with installing some 52-week plans for the Canadian Air Force VIP, SAR (CN-295W), DHC8A, Challenger and C-17 fleets.

    “Every word has consequences. Every silence, too.” - Sartre

  • Eine interessante Anmerkung ist, dass Bombardier kürzlich eine weitere Iteration dieses Jets vorgestellt hat, den Challenger 3500. Äußerlich ist es immer noch ein Challenger 350, aber einige Dinge aus der Global-Serie sind in diese Jet-Klasse (Avionik und Innenausstattung) eingeflossen. Wir können also immer noch 3500er neu lackieren, wenn sie erscheinen!

    Der Name ist offensichtlich eine Anknüpfung an das größere Angebot an Flugzeugen.

    +++

    An interesting note is that Bombardier recently unveiled another iteration of this jet, the Challenger 3500. Externally it's still a Challenger 350, but a few things from the Global series have come down into this class of jet (avionics and interiors). So we still get to repaint 3500s when they start appearing!

    The name is obviously a tie-in to the larger range of aircraft.

    “Every word has consequences. Every silence, too.” - Sartre

  • Das überarbeitete p/k funktioniert bei mir recht gut. Ich habe mir einen für den AIM CRJ2 angesehen und das ist eher ein Beispiel dafür, womit ich umgehen kann. Das Malen dauert zu lange für die Ergebnisse, die ich erziele (ich bin praktisch selbstständig, also gibt es viel mehr Verwendungsmöglichkeiten für meine Zeit), also kann ich es sowieso nicht wirklich zur Gewohnheit machen. Ich habe einige Kurven ausprobiert, meine größte Schwachstelle, und sie kamen so lala heraus - besser als ich erwartet hatte, aber immer noch nicht sehr gut.

    Ich könnte im Laufe der Zeit ein paar meiner Platzhaltertexturen ersetzen, zum Beispiel wenn fast eine komplette Flotte von anderen Repaintern verfügbar ist und ich schnell und böse eine machen kann, nur um das Lineup zu füllen. Die meisten meiner bestehenden "Repaints" beinhalten die Verwendung des Repaints von jemand anderem und das Ändern der Registrierung und offensichtlich nicht in der Lage zu sein, herumzusprechen! Ich habe das mit Jet Storys Premier 1, SP-RIO gemacht. Es ist wichtiger, einzelne Flottenmitglieder zu haben, wenn sie 52-Wochen-Flugpläne haben, und insbesondere, wenn sie alle unterschiedliche Lackierungen haben.

    Die Texturen sind DXT1 ohne MIPmap. Ich kann andere Formate machen, wenn das ein Problem ist.

    +++


    The revised p/k is working quite well for me. I looked at one for the AIM CRJ2 and that's more of an example of what I can deal with. Painting takes me too long for the results I get (I'm effectively self-employed so there are plenty more uses for my time) so I can't really make a habit of it anyway. I tried some curves, my main weak spot, and they came out so-so - better than I expected, but still not very good.

    I might be replacing a few of my place-holder textures over the course of time, such as when almost a complete fleet is available from other repainters and I can make a quick and nasty one just to fill the lineup. Most of my existing "repainting" involves using someone else's repaint and changing the registration, and obviously not being able to share around! I did that with Jet Story's Premier 1, SP-RIO. Having individual fleet members is more important when there are 52-week flightplans moving them around, and especially when they are all different liveries.

    The textures are DXT1 without MIPmap. I can do other formats if that's an issue.